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Transparent leadership beats servant leadership(entropicthoughts.com)
317 points by ibobev 8 hours ago | 152 comments
  • CodeMage7 hours ago

    From the post: "The middle manager that doesn't perform any useful work is a fun stereotype, but I also think it's a good target to aim for."

    This is the kind of argument that makes people come up with middle manager stereotypes in the first place. In fact, the whole post is a great example of why middle manager stereotypes exist: it starts with a straw man argument and comes up with a "better alternative" that makes life easier for the manager, regardless of what the manager's reports really need.

    I've seen this whole "I will empower you to do everything on your own" principle in action and it's exhausting. Especially when the word "empower" is a used as a euphemism for "have you take on additional responsibilities".

    Look, boss, sometimes empowering me is just what I need, but sometimes I need you to solve a specific problem for me, so I can keep solving all the other problems I already have on my plate.

    • nlawalker6 hours ago |parent

      When I was a manager I had to take a training based on the book "The Coaching Habit." It left me really sour on the role, and explained some of the behavior of previous managers of mine that I least appreciated, specifically that their approach to management seemed to be to just get me to articulate and explain my problems over and over until I somehow rubber-ducked myself into solving them myself. When that didn't work, it transitioned to "so how can I help?", which would again eventually be turned around into "now you know how to go help yourself", no matter how direct the request was or how much it really needed management authority behind it.

      I get that the point of the strategy is to help people with strong director-style personalities to listen and empathize a bit more, but in my experience it ended up being implemented as "my responsibility to my reports is to listen and nod."

      • skeeter20203 hours ago |parent

        Three buckets of "management":

        1. Mentoring: "this is what I did in a similar situation..." - overused and often not as similar or detailed as needed.

        2. Coaching: "what do you think?" valuable for longer term development that depends on deeper thought and introspection; Your immediate problems a generally neither of these.

        3. Sponsoring: "You mentioned you're looking for X and I heard about a new project where you could learn... want me to connect you?" under-used by managers, super valuable but harder to scale & can be hit/miss.

        What your ICs actually need a lot of the time: "solve this problem for me." Most managers can't do this, which is why they became managers. The good ones combine their own skills with 1-3 above to unblock and DON'T push it back on the requestor.

        • jvanderbotan hour ago |parent

          "Can't" is not why people become managers.

          At least be thoughtful and say "Won't" (because they prefer management)

      • harrall3 hours ago |parent

        My biggest complaint about some people is that they measure success by the act of doing and rarely by the result.

        If I help someone, I am checking if you no longer need help. If I say I’m going to be there at a certain time, I remember every time I’m late. If I do laundry a certain way so I won’t lose a sock, I make sure I haven’t lost a sock. When I do something, my brain replays me “Oh the last time you did this, you made this mistake. Do you want to try it a different way?”

        People read how you are “supposed to do things” and feel good when they do it. If you switch to measuring your work by your result, you learn way faster and also get really good at things.

        • tomnipotent30 minutes ago |parent

          How do you measure results until something is done? It's simply not possible to reliably measure or predict the result of something before it's done, and at best any numbers will be incredibly rough estimates.

          The only thing we can control for is the act of doing.

        • ToucanLoucan2 hours ago |parent

          You've put into excellent words what I have done my whole life. Intent matters but it isn't sufficient. If you "meant to be on time" but weren't, you failed. Simple as. You don't need to lash yourself about it but too many folk are ready to give themselves a pat on the back for good intentions, or trying but failing, etc.

          If you say you're gonna be somewhere, show the fuck up. Anything short is a miss. Failing to account for that makes you an asshole, IMO.

          • gretchan hour ago |parent

            If you’re interested in the subject and want to read more, the concept is commonly called “outcome oriented” vs “process oriented”.

            A LOT of workplace conflict arises out of outcome oriented ppl having to work with process oriented people.

      • psunavy035 hours ago |parent

        This is a main reason why Agile Coaches often end up with such a bad rap, and the role is on the outs.

        They're supposed to be people who can work with leadership to ensure the right people are on the right teams working on the right stuff at the right time. And turn around and be able to help teams untangle their QA and CI/CD processes to speed delivery.

        Instead, the damn "life coaches" got their foot in the door and started infecting everything. The only time "coaching" is a valid approach is when both you and a coachee agree that the person has what they need to solve the issue and just needs a sounding board or a rubber duck. There's nothing more infuriating that needing help solving a problem and being told "well how would YOU solve the problem?" Idiot, if I knew that, I wouldn't be asking!

        • BobaFloutist4 hours ago |parent

          Also makes for a poor metaphor, because coaches in sports are supposed to be absolute experts in absolutely everything about the sport without the physical ability to implement it.

          Imagine if a football player told their coach "I'm not sure how to deal with this specific opponent's strategy" and the coach was like "Well have you tried thinking about it more?"

          • skeeter20203 hours ago |parent

            there are lots of sports coaches that were not good players, but they are absolute experts in their sport. For some reason we've let agile/life coaches convince us that "management" is the event and someone with customer service management experience has a lot to say about software development management. Ted Lasso is a great show, but it's not gonna happen IRL.

            Though the Diamond Dogs would be a great peer group for Engineering Managers...

            https://larahogan.me/blog/manager-voltron/

      • eecc3 hours ago |parent

        So basically a crash course in psychoanalysis?

      • bsoles4 hours ago |parent

        The "required" reading for newly minted managers in my $billion company was/is this shit called "One Minute Manager": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_One_Minute_Manager, including "one minute reprimands" as if employees are children. Happily, I am no longer a manager.

      • citizenpaul5 hours ago |parent

        > "The Coaching Habit."

        Oh wow. This comment just completely explained the worst "manager" I ever had. They must have been using this terrible method.

        >no matter how direct the request was or how much it really needed management authority behind it.

        They nearly drove me insane with this circular cycle. It was the only job I ever walked out on. I emailed on a Sunday night that I would not be returning to the office after a particularly terrible cycle of this nonsense.

        To be clear I am not a "needy" employee. When I ask a manager for something it is because I do not have the authority do the thing.

        • pyrolistical3 hours ago |parent

          Tell the manager you are assuming their authority.

          You will force the answer out of them either way

          • hyperhelloan hour ago |parent

            This is really how it’s done. Don’t go over their head; go under their boss’s.

    • jf225 hours ago |parent

      One of my worst job experiences was when I depended on a colleague who wouldn't deliver. Any feedback or conversations with that colleague mostly resulted in tantrums and empty promises.

      The lack of delivery severely harmed the services I provided to the company and to external users, ruined team morale, and was a huge source of stress.

      My boss always turned the problem back on me, despite him also being my colleague's boss.

      I tried everything I could for 18 months and had extensive documentation of all my attempts, sometimes working in parallel with my boss or using his recommendations.

      Still, the problems persisted and every time I brought it up with my boss it was as if he was oblivious to the ongoing saga. I want to HR and over his head about it and he always fed me shit about "empowerment" and "growth."

      Yeah, I was empowered to interview with other company's and grew into other new roles.

      • cj3 hours ago |parent

        You're describing one end of an extreme.

        The opposite extreme is you have someone on your team who is only able to resolve conflicts by having their boss intervene.

        E.g. you leave some critical feedback in a PR review. The author of the PR doesn't like your comments, so they tell your mutual boss, then your boss comes to you to ask why you left the comments in the PR, instead of the author coming to you directly.

        Obviously there are cases where it's appropriate for you and a coworker to address a problem directly with each other. And there are cases where it makes more sense for your boss to intervene.

        The problem is the culture at some jobs gravitate towards either end of the extreme. The ideal is somewhere in the middle. A good manager will find that balance.

        • jjk1662 hours ago |parent

          > The opposite extreme is you have someone on your team who is only able to resolve conflicts by having their boss intervene.

          What's wrong with that? Resolving conflicts is the boss' job. So long as the team mate is doing their actual job appropriately, that's all that matters.

          > E.g. you leave some critical feedback in a PR review. The author of the PR doesn't like your comments, so they tell your mutual boss, then your boss comes to you to ask why you left the comments in the PR, instead of the author coming to you directly.

          The author should not be coming to you directly, going through the boss is the appropriate route. If the author's complaints were unreasonable, it should be the boss telling them that, not you. If your boss is coming to you, it means they feel the author's complaints are at least partially valid, and you should be hearing that from your boss, not the author.

          It's not necessarily a bad thing if people bypass the manager to settle things directly, so long as both parties are comfortable with that, but it's not a happy medium.

          • chowellsan hour ago |parent

            Handling negative feedback on a PR is a necessary skill for a developer. A manager should only get involved if it becomes hostile. Negative is very far from hostile.

      • parliament323 hours ago |parent

        There's a good chance he was an executive's nephew or some other protected class.

    • FuriouslyAdrift6 hours ago |parent

      If you ever want to quickly destroy an organization, just separate the ability to control with the responsibility to control.

      Burnout, infighting, and chaos will ensue.

      • indymike5 hours ago |parent

        Control, responsibility and accountability have to align.

        * You should only be accountable for what you are responsible for.

        * You should only be responsible for what you have control of.

        Bad managers hate this structure because in makes them accountable for themselves and their subordinates and prevents deflection of blame to low level employees.

        • cracki4 hours ago |parent

          Please compare and contrast "accountability" and "responsibility".

          • Spivak3 hours ago |parent

            Responsibility without accountability is that it's your job to make sure something gets done but you don't face any real consequences for not doing it.

            Accountability without responsibility is "being the final desk." Leadership is usually in this position where they aren't responsible for designing the product but they are accountable if it doesn't happen and they miss targets.

      • lowboy5 hours ago |parent

        Being responsible for something while having little/no control is so demoralizing & infuriating.

        • nlawalker4 hours ago |parent

          Ah yes, the need for "influence without authority", i.e. "the real challenge of this project is that you have been organizationally set up to fail, and we expect you to find a way to succeed in spite of that."

          • jghn4 hours ago |parent

            This is what removed any lingering thoughts I had about moving up the corporate ladder. If in order to succeed I either need to do certain things or at least get other groups to do those things, and if I'm not allowed to do those things, and if no other group is willing to do those things, and if no one above me is going to change the circumstances, why on earth would anyone think this could be successful?

        • stego-tech5 hours ago |parent

          As someone once again in such a role, it really is, and it never gets easier.

      • exogenousdata3 hours ago |parent

        This is a wonderful, succinct way of capturing this danger to businesses as they grow & jump the gap!

    • skeeter20203 hours ago |parent

      >> but sometimes I need you to solve a specific problem for me, so I can keep solving all the other problems I already have on my plate.

      Managers definitely need to contribute and this is a great way to do so, and also build credibility with your team. You don't get the fun or deep technical problems; that's not your job, but you can fulfill whatever transparent leadership is (I think?) by protecting your team from the noise (i.e. the shit umbrella) and contributing in a supporting role (the servant part). The hard / tiring thing is doing this consistently and repeatedly.

      • ryoshu3 hours ago |parent

        The reward is helping people hone their craft and grow in their careers. Being a shit shield sucks, but the trade-off is worth it.

    • reactordev5 hours ago |parent

      It was clear the author never actually performed servant leadership. If they did, they would be writing a different article about how much work they did to support their team instead of “how much lack of work can I get away with”. They sounded like an absent manager.

    • Spooky232 hours ago |parent

      In my experience, leadership is the ability to guide and direct, power is the ability to influence and control. Leaders wield implicit power. Officers of the company wield explicit power.

      I see management in the ideal case of finding leaders and equipping them with organizational authority. That's often not what happens, and when you fuck up, the tail wags the dog, and you give empty suits power they can't control. It's one of the reasons "MBA" managers often are perceived as shitty - they lack domain knowledge, have mediocre finance/accounting skills and are invested with lots of power.

      As a senior leader in a tech org, my value is deep understanding of the business and the engineering landscape broadly, along with deep knowledge in a few verticals. My goal every day is to plan and articulate what we need to do, make sure my teams have what they need, and help "litigate" disputes and problems. "Agile" religious adherents, project and program managers are not leaders.

      Engineers in general are terrible at organizing people, and tend to create little fiefdoms of straw bosses. When I look for directors and managers, I'm looking for the kids who played Civ and SimCity who aren't literalists.

    • SoftTalker4 hours ago |parent

      For me the worst of this is organizations where employees have to write their own performance reviews. Eff that. You're the boss, you tell me how I'm doing. If there's one thing a manager should be accountable for it is the development and evaluation of the people the manager is responsible for.

    • moogleii3 hours ago |parent

      It isn't the best written piece, but your snippet feels taken grossly out of context. The rest of it:

      "A common response is to invent new work, ask for status reports, and add bureaucracy. A better response is to go back to working on technical problems. This keeps the manager’s skills fresh and gets them more respect from their reports. The manager should turn into a high-powered spare worker, rather than a papersshuffler."

      While being an IC and a manager is quite challenging, I think it's worth discussing the various permutations of it (only one of which is what the author has written about). It can lead to all sorts of systems (round robin leadership within a team being probably one of the most experimental). But for a more conservative, traditional system, there are many examples, e.g. Apple leadership coming out of former ICs.

    • dasil0036 hours ago |parent

      That entire paragraph is a string of poorly-articultated, cringeworthy sentences. In fact the whole article seems to be a series of strawmen set up on the basis of oddly specific and naive interpretations of management concepts like "servant leadership". There's basically nothing in here that I would agree with as a blanket statement without a lot of company and org-specific provisos.

      All that said, to be charitable, I think what the author meant to express is that you don't want to make yourself a bottleneck as a manager, which is a common failure mode for newly converted IC to junior manager. Where he goes off the rails in the most tone-deaf way is describing that as "not doing useful work". As a manager your work is constantly observing what people are doing, staying the hell out of the way when things are working, and leaning in when things are not going well from a team and outcomes perspective. Doing that well is incredibly challenging and important work.

      • brabel6 hours ago |parent

        > All that said, to be charitable, I think what the author meant to express is that you don't want to make yourself a bottleneck as a manager,

        That's not being charitable, that's just having basic interpretation skills of the very next sentence of the article.

        • dasil003an hour ago |parent

          Huh? The next sentence is: "The difference lies in what to do once one has rendered oneself redundant."

    • HWR_142 hours ago |parent

      The biggest issue in the post is "creates direct links between supply and demand". One of the more important things to do as a manager is sit in hours of meetings so your reports can get a fifteen minute synopsis about the decisions made. And represent your reports in those meetings.

    • zoeysmithe7 hours ago |parent

      Yep, this is just a ploy to create a PMC that actually has no skill workers in it. You just shove MBAs, nepos, etc into these roles and just have them gobble up some managerial course which is often nothing but: delegate, CYA, and 'manage expectations.'

      I dont think we need to go back to the old ideas of The Manager who is Above It All and Doesn't Get Their Hands Dirty. At least at middle levels.

    • Forgeties796 hours ago |parent

      >Look, boss, sometimes empowering me is just what I need, but sometimes I need you to solve a specific problem for me, so I can keep solving all the other problems I already have on my plate.

      One of the reasons I really like my current manager is he spends a lot more time reminding us he can/offering to "take care of any blockers." His whole management style can be summed up as "Why is it blocked? Ok, leave it to me." Frankly I love it. If it's something we should take care of he's very specific about it too.

      • rootnod35 hours ago |parent

        My first manager at Amazon was like that. Loved him to pieces. He didn't micro-manage, he didn't even fully care about the scrum. Just said "I can see the ticket status myself. If you are blocked by something, need any info or resource, I'll hunt it down for you, otherwise you keep cooking".

      • phil216 hours ago |parent

        I often describe myself as a bulldozer for my team. My job is to lay out clear expectations, do my best to steady the course free of external chaos, and bulldoze a clear path for the team to get stuff done.

      • eithed6 hours ago |parent

        Agree and follow this principle to certain degree, however there are caveats here - something being a blocker shouldn't prevent you from trying to resolve the blockers by yourself or work with your boss to resolve them ie - "hey boss, I'm blocked with task A with refactor of this code; are you happy for me to do XYZ?". Then I have options to say: "yes! excellent! go ahead!" or "no, we need to do ASD here" or "no, we cannot do XYZ right now". If every time people encountering blockers would come to me to resolve them, or wait until they're resolved I'd not get anything done. On the flipside, if every time a blocker is encountered people were to handle it themselves, then a) it might not align with my vision on what actually needs to be done here b) I'm blindsighted with what was actually done.

        Clear boundaries and strategies eliminate these caveats = team members are aligned on what they can make decision for and general direction the team is heading towards.

        • Forgeties796 hours ago |parent

          Yeah like I said if we are straying in to over-reliance/not really doing our job, he clearly lays out what to do and says "there go take care of it" a few times. He does a good job of not fostering a culture of constantly playing CYA

      • bena4 hours ago |parent

        Reminds me of something Joel Spolsky wrote about on his blog. The best managers were those who "moved the furniture out the way". Basically clear the way for the people working on the problem to do so.

        • Forgeties792 hours ago |parent

          Like that metaphor

    • michaelcampbell5 hours ago |parent

      > it starts with a straw man argument ...

      Perhaps they have, but there are also no shortage of middle managers that are adequately described by it. I worked for one for a few years.

    • venturecruelty4 hours ago |parent

      Friendly reminder that management exists to get you to justify your expensive pay check. Every employer-employee relationship is adversarial. Adjust accordingly.

  • simonw5 hours ago

    My first few years as an engineering manager were heavily influenced by my idea that I needed to be a "shit umbrella" - I needed to protect my team from all of the shit raining down around the organization so they could focus on getting stuff done.

    I eventually realized that this is a terrible management philosophy! Your team would much rather understand what's going on, why things are happening and why certain projects are high priority, and protecting them from the shit doesn't actually help with that at all.

    • Gormo5 hours ago |parent

      There's a big difference between protecting a team from all the shit and hiding it from them completely.

      It's good to be a transparent shit umbrella. The team should absolutely have visibility into what's going on, and understand why certain decisions are being made, but a good manager does need to step in to avoid the shit hitting them directly.

      • lesdeuxmagots3 hours ago |parent

        Love the idea of the transparent shit umbrella.

        Some people advocate keeping the team inside and telling them it's raining. But how far does that go? Are you keeping them in an underground bunker? Or is it a room with a window? A skyscraper with floor to ceiling windows surrounding them?

        I'm of the mind that if it's possible, the team needs to be outside in the shit rain while protected by the shit umbrella. But they need to FEEL the weather, not just see it or vaguely know of it, but still protected enough to be able to get to where they need to go.

        Of course, what if the shit storm is overwhelming and coming in sideways, or if it's flooding shit, so that even with protection, everyone is stuck in a quagmire? Well, obviously, don't actually let them go outside, but 1) the company has much bigger, likely existential problems it needs to deal with, and 2) the team REALLY needs to know.

        Needless to say, this all applies more to decently high functioning organizations, but not to completely dysfunctional ones. When it's a nuclear winter outside, everyone is bought into the idea of staying in the bunker and just keeping calm and carrying on regardless of how bad it is outside. There's nowhere to go, you're there just to survive.

        • sillyfluke36 minutes ago |parent

          To your point about dysfunctional orgs:

          After deploying your transparent shit umbrella, your next problem is your own shitty boss or your boss's boss who will get pissed off you are using a transparent umbrella once that transparency starts blowingback on them. Because once your team learns that it's raining shit outside, they will want to know what you're doing to mitigate, reverse, or sidestep the shit. Some of the time, the things you confide to your team in the course of this feedback will piss off adjacent teams or some people up the ladder once they get wind of it (your opinion of some decisions, or the perceived negative consequences of your mitigation strategy on said people) Hence your umbrella being transparent makes what people euphemistically call "managing up" much more fucking annoying. I don't claim that there is an alternative, just that it's a fact of the principled life (one result being getting fired, often ironically for not being a "team player"). I don't have a fix, but would like to hear some if anyone has any.

        • samwillis3 hours ago |parent

          > But they need to FEEL the weather

          You mean they need to smell it!

      • simonw4 hours ago |parent

        "Transparent shit umbrella" is indeed a much more useful metaphor.

    • michaelcampbell5 hours ago |parent

      You CAN tell the team it's raining and details of the weather without letting them get overly wet.

      There's middle ground here.

    • kepeko5 hours ago |parent

      Agree. team needs to know about the shit. It's important information that helps them prioritize their work and motivates them as they know that what they do is important for the bigger bosses. If manager shields me from everything I go apathetic, not knowing why I even do the boring stuff if manager doesn't tell me his manager is giving shit

      • taurathan hour ago |parent

        I hate having to rely on my own sense of what happened in a meeting, or which executive is upset about something. While its usually accurate, it's been borne out of chaotic leadership and shouldn't be necessary, especially if its to try to get off the tracks when a freight train is coming.

        Sometimes the culture of poor management is so ingrained and normalized people really don't understand what the problem is. That usually ends with me looking elsewhere, as taking on the responsibility other's won't while not having authority has lead to multiple full years lost to burnout.

    • tonyarkles5 hours ago |parent

      I'm laughing because I used that exact same phrase: "shit umbrella". Like some of the other replies mentioned, telling your team it's raining is great. The balance I found was to let them know what's coming and why but to let leadership's "pivots" to stabilize for a few days before sharing the unfiltered shit stream with my reports. This meant that the team still knew what was going on early but didn't panic as much when there was a sudden crazy random request from leadership that would be highly disruptive.

    • munchbunnyan hour ago |parent

      You do need to expose your team to some of the shit that's getting flung or else your team gets used to operating under clean conditions and loses its tolerance.

      For better or for worse, politics and randomization is just a thing in our jobs, and for at least some people in your team that means part of career growth is learning to handle it. If you, the manager, are the sole person capable of being the "shit umbrella" for the team, that's another way that your team gets a bus number of 1. (I learned this the hard way.)

      In an ideal world you have some senior engineers who are more of the "don't bother me and let me cook" persuasion, and then you have at least one who is probably on track to become a manager, and they are your backup when you can't be in two places at once.

    • cracki4 hours ago |parent

      Distinguish between "seeing the shit" and "being hit by it all".

    • wmeredith5 hours ago |parent

      Shit umbrella is not a great analogy. More like a shit filter. Let through what needs to be let through and block all the distracting crap.

    • zawaideh5 hours ago |parent

      The metaphor I prefer is to be a transparent shit umbrella.

    • dyauspitr2 hours ago |parent

      A shit umbrella is not a two way block. It keeps shit from falling onto the employees but doesn’t prevent employees from knowing what is happening at higher leadership levels.

  • onion2k7 hours ago

    "Servant Leadership" is a term was coined by Robert Greenleaf in his 1977 book "Servant Leadership: A Journey into the Nature of Legitimate Power and Greatness", which is very specifically about being a church leader. Many of the more generic ideas are applicable in any leadership scenario but if you read the book it's very clear that it was not designed with business leadership in mind. You shouldn't really expect it to apply to being a leader in a tech company.

    • codingdave7 hours ago |parent

      Many terms and frameworks evolve beyond their original intent, so I'm not too worried that this has evolved, too.

      I've always found it is easier to understand servant leadership as the opposite end of the spectrum from autocratic leadership: Is the leader primarily concerned about growing their own power/success, or growing the power/success of those who work for them?

      There is a lot of middle ground between those two extremes, but without that contrast in mind, you can easily lose track of what the terms mean. The article does a decent job of trying to find a healthier middle ground, IMO.

      • onion2kan hour ago |parent

        The problem with servant leadership is twofold:

        Firstly, in 'proper' servant leadership as taught by Greenleaf the leader is supposed to put the church before their own needs and wants. It is not about serving the people who report to you; it's about serving the organisation first. In a business context that's horribly toxic and a great way to spend years being exploited by a company that will grind you to burnout for very little money. Thankfully most people don't actually follow what Greenleaf teaches because they think it's about the people.

        Secondly though, people don't bother to read much about it. They hear the term and a basic summary, and then fill in the blanks based on their own biases and assumptions. Consequently when someone says they practise servant leadership you can't know what they mean unless you know them well. People who practise their version of servant leadership assume other people mean the same thing by it, and automatically align themselves with that person based on (probably) false assumptions. It is not a helpful term because it's used for a huge range of leadership styles.

      • bluGill6 hours ago |parent

        The problem is when things evolve we no longer know if someone refers to the evolved form or the original. Or more importantly if the evolved form retains the important parts of the original.

        • f1shy5 hours ago |parent

          Exactly. And like evolution, what of the millions of species it evolved to are referring to.

          IMHO either stick with the original, or say “like X with following changes/details” or just go with a new thing.

    • dogman1446 hours ago |parent

      Servant leadership works just fine in business (as in a competitive non-church environment) as long you’re aware you you’re serving and who you’re working peer to peer with/against/whatever.

      Another term for it somewhat is being a “players coach.”

      End state is you will build loyal as heck teams with it, and if you want to take a very cynical business mindset, it produces with the least pain and suffering three very impotent outcomes - your team will produce output, they won’t hate you along the way, and your team will write you (well earned) manager perf reviews. A manager who has a loyal as heck team up and down the stack builds unique odds of corporate survival.

      All it takes is a little EQ.

    • phantasmish6 hours ago |parent

      All these trendy management things either go back to straight-up bullshit (this is the more common case) or some non-bullshit thing that's been ripped out of its original context such that it becomes bullshit.

  • jppope6 hours ago

    Just wanted to provide a useful link on the topic of leadership. The US army publishes its doctrine for free and updates it somewhat regularly:

    https://talent.army.mil/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/ARN20039_...

    The doctrine is a no-nonsense, no-fluff document based on 200+ years of military tradition where the effectiveness of the leadership is actually life and death. Definitely worth a read if you are interested in leadership.

    • taurathan hour ago |parent

      Last published 2019.

      I think were it rewritten with the current leadership, the very first thing they'd remove would be this topic line:

      > Army professionals recognize the intrinsic dignity and worth of all people and treat them with respect

      Both in political and corporate (especially tech) leadership, this principle has proven to be convenient to say and equally convenient to be tossed aside with the slightest provocation - people are seen as consumers, workers, undesirables, or chattel, not as beings with dignity, that is only for people in privileged positions.

    • TheOccasionalWr3 hours ago |parent

      I'm pretty sure software development of a website doesn't translate to a life and death situation that US army is dealing with. If anything it's why there is so many managers who think this works as if we are solving lives so they have to be strict and we all have to be strict and everyone needs to have their story points updated. The reason why most people went into software development is because they like building stuff so you have to inspire that - it's quite different to why people join US army.

      My 2 cents on the actual manager philosophy is that it depends on the organization and the personal and cultural differences of the team members, some people like leaders, some people like servants and some like equality. At the end of the day everyone has to be aware they do work for the business and why they do stuff. The manager has to make that aware and inspire people.

      Team topologies Shapeup Sooner Safer Happier

      I think those fit most companies.

    • positron265 hours ago |parent

      Because of the Ukraine conflict, the phrase "mission command" came to my attention. It's about C2 rather than leadership but another one of those gems we might filter out in our "Bay Area" (you're all terminally online Europeans / teenagers jk) bubble.

      The idea of mission command is pretty simple. If you see an incidental opportunity that will contribute to the big picture and pursuing it won't compromise the objective of your orders, take it. IIRC they call it something like "scoped initiative."

      If you see an incidental opportunity that you can't take because it would compromise your local objective, you escalate. Up the chain, in the larger scope, that incidental opportunity that would compromise the objective of the smaller unit may be addressable using some available resources of the bigger unit.

      It works by deduction and beautifully because you get the best of both individual initiative and large-scale coordination. It's an example where from-first-principle CS and pragmatic emergent systems resonate because it's near a morally true optimum.

      In the context of OP, knowing the objective of your larger 1-2 organization levels is all the transparency that is every necessary. Neurons aren't smart. Information flows in a network are smart. Don't trust people who start performing and asking for transparency because ninety-nine times out of ten, they can't do better with what they ask for but will make everyone else do worse by breaking the cohesion.

      And finally I read OP. It's a vapid feel-good long-form tweet that is nothing compared to the comment section.

      • cracki3 hours ago |parent

        > ninety-nine times out of ten

        that gave me a chuckle

    • adverbly4 hours ago |parent

      > no-nonsense, no-fluff document

      > Links ~100 pages pdf

      > US army

      Yeah that checks out...

      I kid. Thanks for the share though!

    • AndrewKemendo5 hours ago |parent

      As a multiple time ground force commander both in Iraq and stateside for CI operations, I can firmly state that there is literally zero to be learned about leadership from corporate or political worlds.

      When I left the USG because it’s fundamentally corrupt, I went into private business thinking there were technical/business leaders that had pro-social incentives, and their heads screwed on.

      Man was I wrong.

      The US military has by far the best, all encompassing, most focused and persistently updating leadership development and it’s STILL absolutely garbage.

      There’s ZERO, and actually most likely negative, incentives to think about and apply ethics in business and politics, because at the end of the day the most ruthless will win in the long run.

      • lostlogin5 hours ago |parent

        It sounds like you have been burnt, badly.

        There is surely a business out there that does fit your world view, though the pay and conditions might not.

        In my view, the need for growth at any cost is toxic and leads to all sorts of horrible behaviours.

        • AndrewKemendo4 hours ago |parent

          There are no good organizations, only ones that aren’t completely corrupt yet. Consider that to start and maintain an organization takes significant capital and energy expenditures upfront, which means you need to fund them from somewhere and ask sources of funding are corrupted. Consider: there are no long lasting egalitarian, distributed power, grassroots organizations that can compete at a level of social influence that can overcome or resist the existing power structure.

          I’ve looked at every possible organization that could theoretically fit including; MSF a.k.a. doctors without borders, swords to plowshares, goodwill industries (who employ significant numbers of disabled people for sub min wages while the CEO makes 3M+), Mondragon etc… and they all have exactly the same fucked up incentives

          why? because there is no way to survive as a structure, if your org is made up of people who want to eat and don’t want to be a monk.

          unless your organization is the lead maximalist resource dominator you will be overrun by some organization with no ethics

          Ultimately it comes down to the fact that people have to trade physical and mental work for money to survive. So there is no alternative to do the “right thing” without also risking your own safety and stability in your chosen society. 99.99999% of people are completely unwilling to risk their life on behalf of any particular philosophy - if only because those people don’t feel strongly enough about any particular philosophy to actually put themselves on the line for it.

          So whoever has the most money, has the ability to get the most people to work for their goals.

          Unfortunately the people with all the money/power do not care about anything other than growing their own personal power

          • lostlogin3 hours ago |parent

            > why? because there is no way to survive as a structure, if your org is made up of people who want to eat and don’t want to be a monk.

            The worse offenders in terms of corrupting power structures seem to be religious organisations, so being a monk is out too.

            That power eventually corrupts shouldn’t rule out an organisation, but if it does, start your own and keep it to one employee.

          • alwa4 hours ago |parent

            I’d be curious what you identified as the shortcomings of e.g. MSF or Mondragon. I might throw semi-decentralized social ventures like the IFRC in the mix there too: that emblem alone sure carries an almost-talismanic degree of social weight, seemingly worldwide, I think in large part because they’re foresworn from swinging around their influence outside of their lane.

            And I mean… “don’t want to live like a monk” seems like a telling qualifier: the whole monastic lifestyle seems pretty widespread and enduring across cultures and through time… is the humbler mode of religious devotion an example of what you’re looking for?

            In any case you’ve clearly thought deeply and widely about this question—I’d be interested to read your thoughts if you end up collecting them somewhere!

            • AndrewKemendoan hour ago |parent

              I’m simply acknowledging that only a tiny fraction of any group will find themselves devoted to the group in the “monastic” way of self erasure

      • sa463 hours ago |parent

        That's quite a strong claim. I disagree. Military leadership, like business leadership, is imperfect. Both vary based on individuals, the operating environment, and culture.

  • vinceguidry6 hours ago

    Author gives own take on what they thinks servant leadership means, then invents a supposedly different kind of leadership that is just servant leadership, taken into a different context than the original church one, then gives it a new name, one that doesn't really tie into their definition.

  • alistairSH8 hours ago

    I was never taught that servant leadership should be some weird "manager as parent" relationship.

    Instead, servant leadership implies the manager serves the team (as the name implies). That includes removing impediments, but also includes empowering the team, ensuring their careers are growing, etc.

    • awban hour ago |parent

      Exactly.

      It’s the concept of a management chart as an inverted pyramid with each layer holding up and supporting the layer above them. If you imagine a promotion as working your way down the corporate pyramid, then it’s easier to see how the managers at the bottom are carrying more weight and deserving of higher pay.

      As opposed to a pyramid where it’s visually represented as the broader management layers supporting the layers above them.

      In a pyramid, it looks like the CEO has a cushy, overpaid job. In an inverted pyramid it looks like they have the weight and responsibility of the company on their shoulders.

    • rietta3 hours ago |parent

      Very succinct, I agree.

      I honestly have never heard anyone—even those executing it poorly—try to frame Servant Leadership the way the original author did here (the "curling parent" analogy).

      I have certainly seen people fail badly at practicing this style, but that failure was invariably due to a lack of character, poor communication skills, or other individual execution matters, not an issue with the core concept of servant leadership itself.

    • mergy6 hours ago |parent

      Yes indeed. Thank you.

  • evolve2k2 hours ago

    I want to reproblematise the word ‘leadership’ here. The phrase ‘servant leadership’ is actually a paradigm shift away from classic ‘out-the-front’ ‘the-boss-knows-best’ ‘dominate-others’ leadership.

    What the author is missing is parallelisation. By definition in systems of clear one person in charge leadership the work bottlenecks and power centralises, hard.

    In models of servant leadership, it’s possible for multiple people to bring leadership and leadership skills all at once.

    In a group of a dozen or more people, huge bottlenecks and ego power crap are resolved as multiple people can bring servant leadership.

    It’s single core vs parallel, in the later leadership can then come from all participants, even the very young and vulnerable involved in the group can learn to do this.

    The emphasis is on skill sharing and being of service OVER power hoarding.

  • yet-another-guy7 hours ago

    This is just trying too hard. "Servant Leadership" is a buzzword invented to divert the general opinion from the power mechanics that hierarchical organizations are funded upon, i.e., the boss (sorry, leader) commands and the direct reports execute. Being "servant" basically just means being a decent human being, as per putting people in the right condition to carry out their duties, not coming up with unrealistic expectations, and do the required 1:1 coaching/mentoring for career development.

    Hand-helding employees as this "blocker removal" interpretation of servant leadership seems to imply is just the pathway to micromanagement. It's ok to shield your juniors from the confusing world of corporate politics, but if your direct reports need you to do a lot of the sanitization/maturation of work items and requirements then why should you even trust their outputs? At that point you're basically just using them as you would prompt an AI agent, double- and triple-checking everything they do, checking-in 3 times a day, etc.

    This "transparent" leadership is the servant leadership, or what it's intended to be anyway in an ideal world. Some elements of it are easily applicable, like the whole coaching/connecting/teaching, but they also are the least measurable in terms of impact. The "making yourself redundant", i.e., by avoiding being the bottleneck middle-man without whose approval/scrutiny nothing can get done is fantasy for flat organizations or magical rainbowland companies where ICs and managers are on the exact same salary scale. And it will continue to be as long as corporate success (and career-growth opportunities) is generally measured as a factor of number of reports / size of org. managed.

    • zeroq7 hours ago |parent

      "Servant leadership" is not a buzzword but it's been misused and abused by Big Corporations to the point that it basically lost its meaning [1].

      For me - personally - the idea is about being less of a boss and more of a nightwatchman or janitor.

      I believe in agency and ownership and - in sane environment - people can be left alone with clear objectives. It's more about removing obstacles.

      I'll give you a simple example.

      Once a week a maid comes to our apartment. Despite a clear power balance disproportion (it's easier to find a new maid than a senior engineer) and her being used to being transparent and prioritizing to not disturb tenants for me it's the other way around. I'm super happy to hastily finish a call or leave my room is she feels the need to disturb me, and if she needs an extra pair of hands I'm happy to help her with anything. After all, I'm more interested with the final result than feeling important.

      We have a bucket list of tasks than has to be performed that slightly exceeds her capacity and she has a full right to prioritize things. It took my a while but I eventually convinced her that it's ok to skip things - like cleaning the windows - if she's feeling under the weather or it's cold outside rather than faking it.

      Most of the pointy hairs I worked in corporate environments would probably prepare a list of requirements and walked through the apartment with a checklist every time she would finish giving her a full, harsh performance review.

      But that doesn't build trust and long term relationship.

      And after some time she developed - what people around here call ownership - and sometimes I feel she cares about the household more than I do.

      Hope that makes sense.

      • dugmartin6 hours ago |parent

        I forgot where I read it (Steve McConnell?) but the best analogy I've heard for a boss/project leader is to think of your job is moving a house and the bosses job is to be a few streets ahead taking down telephone pole wires so you aren't slowed down.

  • jedbergan hour ago

    Looking back at the best leaders I've ever worked for, they all followed that philosophy that was explicitly stated at Netflix: Context not Control.

    The goal of the manager was to explain to their reports what problems the team need to solves and why. Make sure the team was aware of any factors elsewhere in the org that might make a difference, and then connect the people on their team with the people on other teams who they need to talk to.

    Beyond that the leader's job was to seek out such context from their peers and leadership.

    But then it was up to the IC to figure out the how. The manager never told me how to accomplish the task unless I asked, and that was more of a mentorship than as a manager. And when I was a junior, most of that mentorship came from my more senior peers than my manager.

  • dpflan8 hours ago

    With "servant leadership" in its current form being attributed to Greenleaf, here is the "source of truth" on servant leadership: https://greenleaf.org/what-is-servant-leadership/

    "Growth" of those being led is a key concept it seems, which I would think is really only possible when the leader doesn't do everything by themselves as a die-hard servant, but utilizes the "leadership" part to help subordinates learn to lead themselves.

    Granted this realm of ideas can be a gray-area, but it seems like servant leadership as presented by the author here does not incorporate the concept of growing those that they lead -- as indicated by the fact they have self-invented a new "buzzword" which actually seems to be involve the behaviors as laid out by servant leadership -- am I missing something?

  • siliconc0w4 hours ago

    The problem I've found with servant leadership in large orgs is the direct manager usually has little agency over problems. The best you can get is maybe they can provide additional context on the good intentions behind the bad decisions. This is essentially by design, a critical role they play are to be the scape goats and shock absorbers for the bad machinery above them.

  • adverbly4 hours ago

    Between the article and the comments in this thread there is actually some pretty good advice here and reasonable and nuanced takes to management.

    Bit surprised by this. Has the hn community aged into management or something?

    I guess we are not as young and naive as we used to be...

  • trunnell3 hours ago

    Having a bad manager in past roles can be some of the best "manager training."

    If one your past managers did something recommended in this article but it caused problems, that's ok! It just means you have seen another failure mode that the author didn't experience.

    I remember being in a meeting with a bunch of the best managers at a former company. "Why did you originally want to be a manager?" was one of the first questions passed around the circle. The most common answer was, "I had this one really bad manager and I figured that surely I could do better."

    • mrguyoramaan hour ago |parent

      >"I had this one really bad manager and I figured that surely I could do better."

      That doesn't mean that those people are learning from prior bad management. That could instead mean that management tends to be people who are convinced of their own above average competence.

      Did anyone ask the reports of those managers whether they were any good?

    • Devasta2 hours ago |parent

      > I had this one really bad manager and I figured that surely I could do better.

      The only thing worse than being invited to a lot of meetings is not being invited to those meetings.

  • hintymad2 hours ago

    > continuously trains their replacement, and > generally makes themselves redundant.

    This is the advice we get from many business books and leadership advices. However, I see more often than not leaders in a company do the opposite to keep their power. There is a missing link to making the good advice actionable: what can the leader do to keep becoming more valuable while making themselves "redundant".

  • justatdotin15 minutes ago

    leadership is not a role it is a shared responsibility; an emergent effect we can all nurture.

  • kagrenac8 hours ago

    I've noticed a number of pieces lately that seem to suggest that managers and leaders doing nothing is actually good. It's been this way for a while - "bring me solutions, not problems" is the classic boss's abdication, placing themselves above their teams as judges and deciders rather than leaders - but I wonder if this current glut is caused by AI anxiety. After all, if your job is to just choose between options that other people will implement, why not have Claude do that? But if it's a good thing for your boss to do nothing, maybe he can keep his job.

    • aranelsurion7 hours ago |parent

      > “bring me solutions, not problems"

      If someone says this unprompted, I’d suspect they aren’t a manager, they aren’t even an employee. They provide roughly the same input one provides while ordering food at a restaurant. Basically they are a customer, but also on the payroll.

      That being said, there are some cases where this might be said out of frustration. I’ve seen in my life a few people whose output is mostly finding and bringing issues to the table for someone else (who?) to magically solve them. That still brings some value, and maybe they’d make excellent auditors, but it wears the team and maybe their managers down.

      • cgearhart6 hours ago |parent

        When I say something like this it usually means “I don’t want to dictate your job to you. You’re here because you’re smart, ambitious, and capable. We’ve talked at length in team settings and 1:1 about our goals. What do you think are the problems that need attention, and what solutions do you propose?”

        The anti-pattern I’ve seen from some folks is that they never want to propose solutions because then it’s someone else’s fault if those fail. These folks often demonstrate minimal ownership of any decisions, so they don’t feel bad complaining about all the problems they see. Not only is that unhelpful, it can actually be very toxic for the team. (As you mentioned.)

        So when I’m saying “bring solutions” what I’m really asking for is some shared ownership of the choices and consequences—I’m asking folks to act like the main character in the story. And don’t worry, I own the consequences of the mistakes in my team to my leadership—this isn’t about throwing them under the bus. (Getting this to work well requires a lot of trust both ways.)

        • jmye15 minutes ago |parent

          > When I say something like this it usually means…

          Yes, exactly. This isn’t “do my job for me”, this is “do the job you have, and solve the problems you should be able to solve”. It’s also, at times, “pointing at fires is junior shit - find a fire extinguisher while you call 911.”

    • ramon1567 hours ago |parent

      Sometimes bosses will repeat your idea to sound like he solutioned it for you, without taking e.g. workload or priority into account.

      I haven't met a boss that wasn't incompetent. Not saying they don't exist, though.

    • AnimalMuppet6 hours ago |parent

      But see, Claude can do nothing even better than it can choose between options. So why should that boss keep his job again?

      "Bring me solutions, not problems" can mean "You are a competent, knowledgeable employee, who has identified a problem. You know enough to look at the alternatives and decide which is best, or at least which ones are workable. Bring me that, not just the problem."

      And if it does mean that, it's empowering. You with your hands on the situation, you get to tell the boss what you think the best answer is, and the boss backstops you from deciding something that won't work in the bigger picture.

  • rasengan0an hour ago

    >transparent leadership. In my book, a good leader ...

    I practice this in my day job, as in that is the default mode for continued employment. Not sure how these practices are new. I wonder if it is a generational thing.

  • great_wubwub7 hours ago

    I once worked for a guy who'd obviously seen the term Servant Leadership on a bumper sticker somewhere and figured that meant he was the leader and we were the servants. Worst boss I ever had, and I've been doing this 30+ years and have had a bunch of bad bosses.

    Why not just 'competent leadership', where 'competent' means 'figure out what your people need you to do and do it'?

  • herval5 hours ago

    > Servant leadership seems to me a lot like curling parenting: the leader/parent anticipate problems and sweep the way for their direct reports/children.

    That's not what "Servant leadership" is. It's about _letting the team lead_ - and they can come to you if they need help - instead of _pushing the team_. So in practice it's the opposite of anticipating problems. If something, servant leadership gets a bad rep for being used as an excuse to let people fall on the sword, instead of protecting them

    The rest of the post is just describing the role of "Management".

  • ef2k5 hours ago

    I think the premise is a little shaky since a good servant leader is already transparent. But there's some good takeaways. Leaders should inform their team of what's happening behind the scenes and allow them to understand why things are playing out the way they are. Allowing people to take on more responsibility, if they want it, is a healthy sign of an organization, but it shouldn't be imposed nor expected if they already have enough on their plates.

  • MrDrDr6 hours ago

    IMO: I think there is a helpful distinction to be made between leadership and management. Leadership provides purpose and inspiration. Management provides, coordination and motivation. I’m not saying one person can’t do both.

    I do agree that most management books read like parenting books - but I’d add that whats more important than the method is consistency in whatever approach you believe in. I’m not sure that managers/leaders will ever do that well relying on a book or a special ‘way’ they have read. They really need to have worked this out for themselves.

  • rietta3 hours ago

    I think the author is significantly straw-manning the concept of servant leadership.

    The short take presented in the article doesn't match my lived experience with this style, both in secular and faith-based circles. The core idea is absolutely not that of a "curling parent." Instead, it embodies living the walk, walking the talk, and putting the team's needs before your own ego.

    In fact, this profound concept goes all the way back to Jesus Christ, who modeled it by washing the feet of his disciples—a task reserved for the lowliest servant of the time. This act was deliberately shocking and context-defying. He effectively "turned the world upside down" by saying, "Anyone who wants to be first must be the very last, and the servant of all."

    I'm not trying to proof-text, but this idea is ancient and deep. It's a profound leadership style that is unfortunately often executed poorly or misunderstood by modern practitioners. Poor execution doesn't invalidate the concept itself.

  • derekcheng085 hours ago

    The biggest omission that immediately stands out to me is: "provides a clear sense of direction".

    I've seen so many examples of teams and organizations that experience a lack of clarity, with all sorts of negative downstream consequences - muddled strategies, moving goalposts, fatigue/low morale. Having a leader that can provide that clarity is so important.

  • geoffbpan hour ago

    Servant leadership to me always meant that as a manager I am a servant to the team. Pretty sure that was the intended meaning of it.

  • JoshCole2 hours ago

    It is pleasantly sensible since servant leadership in a sense creates an innocence because of the incents; the underlying reality is that wisdom dwells with prudence. Principles of revelation arise from incentive compatibility. Aiming at the apparent target is good hearted folly.

  • shevy-java5 hours ago

    Hmmm.

    "transparent leadership. In my book, a good leader

    coaches people"

    So ... why does coaching people require transparent leadership?

    I think people can be sneaky and secretive; or transparent. Both can easily be used for coaching and training and teaching people. The other points have a similar issue in my opinion. The article is more like a "feel-good" statement - people subscribe to "be nice and kind". But are all leaders nice and kind? Are evil and mean leaders automatically incompetent and ineffective? I think the analysis part should be decoupled from ethics in regards to "xyz beats abc". One has to define what the goal is.

    For instance, some CEO firing 50% of the people will be critisized by many - but greedy shareholders may get more money that way, so for them they may prefer a CEO that is mean-spirited here. That same mean-spirited CEO could be an awesome family guy and super-friendly with his close reallife friends and family, but when it comes to the company, he is ruthless. And so on and so forth.

  • mergy6 hours ago

    This article is a great example of the Strawman Fallacy. I suppose it's a method to generate traffic but I would argue a key aspect of servant leadership is being transparent that you are in a role that should collectively support and lead to enable and expand the team.

    I feel attributing any sort of parental concepts belittles the meaning here.

  • ErrantX2 hours ago

    I suspect this is written by someone who stepped into managing a team and no further.

    My reflection overall is; he's probably heard of servant leadership but not understood it? It's not about sweeping away problems but more a mindset that your role is to empower. I feel strongly that all new managers should embrace and get good at this because it instills the mindset that the best leaders ultimately only succeed through their team.

    A servant leader who becomes overworked is either not doing their job well (delegation isn't contrary to the mindset!) or, more likely, has a poor leader themselvesw.

    I actually love the concept of transparent leadership but sadly I can't see it come through in his points. They are all things a good leader, a good servant leader, should also do.

    For me transparent leadership becomes more critical as you move up the stack. Once you get to multiple teams or teams of teams leaders must pivot strongly to strategy setting, and in this your servant leadership comes in painting a clear destination for everyone to get to.

    At this point I believe the best leaders are genuinely transparent and the worst keep secrets. One of my most respected mentors framed it as deliberately over-sharing. Which I love, even if I get into trouble for it constantly!

    (I do like the writers anarchic streak; the best leaders are radicals)

  • codyb3 hours ago

    Managing upwards beats being managed in my experience. Seems to work with most managers, and reduces surprises which reduces stress all around and causes course corrections and course alignments earlier.

    I tend to do status updates in public channels before anyone can ask me but I've been the fortunate loner for the last couple years where I get to work with a lot of people but outside a lot of process.

  • maxdtroll4 hours ago

    I've come to define Leadership as

    "The ability to smooth things out for everyone while helping them accomplish their goals"

    I think it helps differentiate the "authoritarian" leader or the "Servant leadership" from the "legitimate" one. All kinds of leadership (sports, education, business, relationships) come from understanding people's needs and providing more efficient strategies to meet them.

  • krosaen4 hours ago

    The founder of Zingerman's (famous deli and family of businesses in Ann Arbor) description of servant leadership is a bit more complete and overlaps heavily with what the author of this post is advocating for:

    https://www.zingtrain.com/article/servant-leadership/

  • lunarcave3 hours ago

    I can't remember where I heard this, but the moment it flipped for me is when someone phrased this as - "be a heat shield".

    A heat shield has some leakage of heat that the people inside know that there's heat, but enough cover that the team is shielded somewhat.

  • neilv7 hours ago

    Some good points to think about. But also note that sometimes you can shield and assist a team on things you can't be transparent about with the team.

    So a hybrid of the two schools of thought might be better than either one (depending on the larger org).

  • browningstreet4 hours ago

    In a world where we've walked away from master/slave, blacklists.. why is servant still being used?

    • ahoka4 hours ago |parent

      What historical systematic injustice do you associate this word with?

      • 9rx3 hours ago |parent

        Serfdom.

  • zetazzed4 hours ago

    This is actually not such bad advice for a manager who manages other managers, though I can see why ICs find it very frustrating. If you are giving high level platitudes and counseling-disguised-as-coaching to a junior new hire, they can rightly ask WTF. But managers, especially those recently moved from IC tech roles, often do benefit from this kind of forced introspection. If they have an underperforming employee, they should bounce ideas around with a more experienced manager, but the first line manager ultimately needs to be the one deciding how to rebalance work to maximize learning or to ultimately make the call to part ways with the employee. If a servant senior leader over them is actually doing the slog of working through the hardest issues (interpersonal conflict, serious direction change needed for team, firing people, top performers at risk of leaving), the first line manager is never going to grow. Similarly "cut out the middleman" advice in the article is great for senior ICs/quasi-architects or sub-managers but potentially toxic for junior engineers who may get steamrolled by the classic "1000 urgent requests issue" that managers or potentially very senior ICs need to drive.

    • dpark4 hours ago |parent

      Why is forced introspection good for managers but not for ICs?

      I’m not saying that the extreme “I do nothing except act as a sounding board and tell my team to solve their own problems” is a good approach. But pushing people to solve their own problems does help them grow. It needs to be a balance.

      A good manager should be able to see what someone is capable of solving with zero, a little, or a lot of help and engage accordingly. And sometimes they can’t solve it at all and the manager has to take it in directly or pull in someone else who can.

  • ChrisMarshallNY5 hours ago

    That's interesting.

    I did everything he mentions in "Transparent Leadership," but also the stuff he talks about in "Curling Parenting."

    I did it for 25 years. Seemed to work. I kept my job.

    In my company, Personal Integrity and Honesty were very important. Not sure how representative that is, in today's world. It was an old-fashioned Japanese corporation.

    • Traubenfuchs5 hours ago |parent

      If the dishonesty worked, you never know it happened!

      So you can never tell how much of it there really is…

      • ChrisMarshallNY5 hours ago |parent

        > If the dishonesty worked

        Try it in an old-fashioned Japanese company, and let me know how it works out. They tend to verify a lot.

        I saw some real disasters, when their culture clashed with modern SV culture.

  • hartator6 hours ago

    > Teach a man to to fish

    “Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Don’t teach a man to fish… and you feed yourself. He’s a grown man. And fishing’s not that hard.”

  • weitendorf5 hours ago

    Kind of a weird hyper-literal interpretation of "servant leadership" IMO. Upskilling and empowering your team, not making yourself a SPOF, treating your adult colleagues like adults, all sounds like servant leadership to me...

  • chzblck6 hours ago

    Coming from the Sales world sometimes I don't want to be taught to fish.

    I'm coming to my VP for help because I already tried diff baits, went to diff ponds, and tried diff reels. I'm coming for a fish finder not a lecture on maybe my casting was off

  • didip6 hours ago

    Can’t wait for AI Slack plugins to replace all low tier middle managers. You can achieve so much transparency since the data is already out there anyway.

    There has to be a better way to organize how ICs communicate. More productivity to unlock.

    • esafak6 hours ago |parent

      That's not going to fix the social problems. What happens when your team needs something from another team?

  • jjk1662 hours ago

    Comparing leadership to parenting right out the gate tells me all I need to know about this person's management ability.

    Your direct reports are not children. You are not raising them out of an altruistic drive to guide the next generation. You are a part of a team of grown adults. You are not above the team, you have a roll on the team. It is an important roll: as a leader you provide high level direction so people are working towards the appropriate goal and confident it is achievable. Likely you are also acting as a manager, coordinating resources and resolving internal and external stakeholder conflicts. This makes the team more efficient, it's important.

    But the people you are leading are the ones actually doing the work. They are likely more skilled at their particular role than you, and knowledgeable about much more. You are not leading them because you are better, you are leading them because that's how you can best contribute to the team.

    Leadership has absolutely nothing to do with coaching, connecting, teaching, explaining, linking, growth inducing, or training their subordinates. Zero. Zip. Nada. It is the role of more senior practitioners to mentor their more junior colleagues. Leaders often are drawn from more senior ranks, so it's not uncommon for a person in a leadership role to also be in a mentoring role, but they are two separate and unrelated positions. If anything, the most important skill of a good leader is effectively soliciting the right information and wisdom from the right team members so they can most effectively leverage their team's expertise.

    You shouldn't be teaching everyone how to communicate with the customer well, you should be identifying the person who is already great at such communication and making sure the rest of the team is giving them what they need to communicate effectively. The person who is great at such communication should be the one teaching that communication to their peers, and not through coaching but by showing everyone how it's done.

    A leadership style of getting your direct reports to do your job for you is transparent in the sense that your subordinates will see right through you.

    • geoffbpan hour ago |parent

      Role*

      Sorry

  • ponooqjoqo5 hours ago

    We should stop normalizing referring to managers or employers as leaders. These are different things.

  • ordinaryradical5 hours ago

    I think this has somewhat strawmanned “servant leadership,” which is more about humility in posture than purely intercepting annoyances and blockers, but nevertheless the conclusions are solid.

  • paofiian hour ago

    My worst managers were “transparent” as in they were basically a telephone game actor between me and my skip, with a little extra anxiety mixed in. Needless to say, I couldn’t quit those jobs fast enough. Who comes up with this nonsense?

  • pragma_x6 hours ago

    I must have misunderstood what "Servant Leadership" actually is. I identify as such, but I also do just about all of the "Transparent Leadership" things called out in the article. I may have to re-evaluate my orientation.

    There's only one place I disagree and that's when it comes to empowering the team to do every last thing within your charge ("become redundant"). Depending on the organization, there are some actions that only a manager is empowered to do. Someone still needs to be present to weigh in on disputes/arguments, break ties, handle performance, reviews, interviews, PIPs, dismissals, and handle _other_ managers when necessary. It's simply not possible delegate these things and in the case of dealing with other managers, can imperil a person's employment.

    Also, I would caution anyone to avoid directly comparing management to parenthood, even as a metaphor. A lot of people have terrible parents, and so model the worst behaviors: they can't nurture a houseplant let alone a human being. I've seen people like this bring the worst possible models for management into the workplace this way, and they do a ton of damage to businesses, psyches, and careers in return. Instead, I urge anyone to look to the carpenter/gardener dichotomy and how good leadership requires a bit of both:

    https://www.intellicoach.com/ep14/

    • alistairSH6 hours ago |parent

      I must have misunderstood what "Servant Leadership" actually is.

      You did not. Or, at least we share an understanding of what the term means which differs substantially from the author's.

  • RA_Fisher5 hours ago

    Excellent analysis. It’s like: servant of whom (themselves)?

  • kentf7 hours ago

    Love this, thank you for sharing.

  • usernamed76 hours ago

    They just described servant leadership and called it something else. It's not about parenting or treating people like children.

  • bbstats7 hours ago

    this is so silly. porque no los dos?

  • dogman1446 hours ago

    Not a great post, I’d not follow it if interested in leading teams long term.

    A Self-admitted self taught manager learns the good parts about servant leadership via self-learning (nice!) but figures that is all there is instead of - “this is interesting, this seems to work but have gaps, what is there to this?”

    If the author did that, they’d discover a massive body of knowledge to include the specific problem they point out - you solve problems for your team, how do they start to solve their own problems?

    Servant leadership works if paired with the following, tuned to the capabilities and maturities of the specific employee:

    - servant leadership: resource your team, umbrella your team, let the smart people you hired do smart things, or turn so so employees into great ones by resourcing them to learn, getting them mentorship, and “sun is strong than cold wind” sort of thinking.

    - Left/right limits and target outcome: consistently inform your team their duty, in exchange for all the above manager work that’s way past the least-effort bar, is to get comfortable solving problems within the bounds of what the solution does and does not need to look like. Force this issue always, and they start solving their own problems at growing speed, and you have a QA check as a manager via documenting those boundaries per project etc

    - train your replacement: part serving your team is reaching there’s probably another sociopath on it who wants to lead teams, wants raw power, and so on. Enable that! Teach them how to lead teams in the above fashion. They’ll realize it works. You’ll train someone who can take over the remaining problem solving. This won’t hurt your own job either.

    Put it all together you’ll get very loyal productive teams of employees who’ll respect you outside of work in your industry where it matters for networking purposes, and you can live with yourself after the laptop closes as you know you’re treating your fellow man/woman the right way while surving in crazy corporate environments.

    In short, bad advice in that article. There’s a whole corpus to leadership beyond what the author figured out in the side and describes here ha.

    Edit - ironically the author then argues for arguably similar as the above, but claims it’s something else of their own invention. Engineers should really grok how there are existing bodies of very useful knowledge for all the things that seem easily dismissible as gaps or weak points from tho social sciences. It’d save them a lot of time.

  • phoronixrly8 hours ago

    You see, this only works in orgs that don't suck. It breaks down the moment employees must be manipulated in some way to the benefit of the company and to the detriment of the employees. Unfortunately a regular occurrence even in countries that have employee protection laws.